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ABS Plastic Balls

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AcudaDave View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01/08/2018 at 2:36pm
Sorry if I missed it in the other thread, but is there a new wave of 40+ balls coming out with ABS plastic? I've read that the ABS balls have spin that is closer to the celluloid. Which balls are out now with the ABS?

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cole_ely View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/08/2018 at 8:15pm
There's one pretty current

http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=81245&title=another-new-ball-synthetic-plastic
W6 fl with Illumina 1.8

Please let me know if I can be of assistance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote igorponger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/09/2018 at 3:00am
Actually, those skillful chemists are able to create many different compositions of ABS plastic.   So far, there is no ABS to emulate celluloid properly.

I once consulted a chemist on the subject, he suggested that ABS would play differently from celluloid due to the thicker shell on the ABS balls now in use.
We still hopefull for a better ABS.

Edited by igorponger - 01/09/2018 at 3:06am
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Baal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/09/2018 at 11:47am
Everyone needs to bear in mind that (1) we don't have ABS balls in the original 40, as opposed to 40+ size, and (2) we don't have any 40+ celluloid balls.  The fact is that no 40+ ball is going to be like what we remember with celluloid because the increased diameter and weight are dominant effects.  No change in material will overcome that, it effects how the ball spins, and how the spin effects bounce and trajectory of the ball.  Current balls are 0.7-1 mm larger in diameter than celluloid and average around 0.07 grams heavier.  Those are big differences.  It is highly likely that a 40+ celluloid ball would feel like any of the other good polyballs we use now.

ABS balls are without question better than cellulose acetate (the material used in earlier generation seamed 40+ balls) because the balls arrive and stay rounder and bounce the right height.  Cellulose acetate yielded balls that were not round, were fragile, and that bounced very low and erratically.  They are also not cheap.  The DHS D40+ balls, which are ABS, are round and very durable.  They weigh more than Nittaku Premium which pretty much entirely explains the differences in how they play.

It is true that there are many versions of ABS polymers and maybe by tweaking the formula manufacturers can get something they like better but we will probably not notice a whole lot.

But the sad fact is, 40+ balls will never be like the celluloid balls of 2013.  Anybody hoping for this will be disappointed.

And, it must be emphasized, this was almost certainly what  ITTF wanted all along.  It is a feature not a bug.  It is true that celluloid was a dangerous material and IMHO it is good for factory workers in China to not have to deal with it anymore, but there was no "impending worldwide ban on celluloid production" as Sharara claimed; and even if there was, there was no reason they needed to suddenly tighten up the way they regulated ball size after decades of not doing it.  This was a way to sneak in another increase in ball size and the resulting effects on the game are as predicted.  A cynical person would say that all the conversation about material has distracted people from the real change, which has been another increase in ball size.  I have gotten used to it by now but I have been playing exclusively with plastic balls now for the last 3.5 years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote qpskfec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/09/2018 at 2:22pm
Originally posted by igorponger igorponger wrote:



I once consulted a chemist on the subject, he suggested that ABS would play differently from celluloid due to the thicker shell on the ABS balls now in use.
We still hopefull for a better ABS.


In the Nittaku patent for their ABS balls, they stated that they tried different wall thicknesses to arrive at a design that came closest to playing and sounding like a cell ball. So it is possible to make small changes in the ABS formula to vary density.

As stated by baal, the 40+ balls are different weight and diameter than the cell balls, so certainly even a 40+ cell ball will play different.

With reasonable assumptions, if you do some high school level physics and compare a cell ball to a heavier/bigger 40+ cell ball of identical material, the 40+ cell ball will spin about 4% less.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rsilvers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/10/2018 at 2:48pm
Are the Nittaku J-Top "practice" 40+ made in Japan seamed balls ABS or polystyrene?


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Tommy16 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tommy16 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/12/2018 at 4:15am
Not totally sure but they behave quite like Nittaku Premium so my ques is that they are ABS balls. They have the best price quality ratio (IMHO).
What is the point of playing safe shots when you can miss with style

My feedback: http://www.mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=67171&KW=&PID=811763&title=tommy16-feedback#811763
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/12/2018 at 8:40am
Never mind


Edited by Lightzy - 01/12/2018 at 8:42am
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Baal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/12/2018 at 10:40am
Originally posted by Tommy16 Tommy16 wrote:

Not totally sure but they behave quite like Nittaku Premium so my ques is that they are ABS balls. They have the best price quality ratio (IMHO).


I agree with this.
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